AMANDA KELLER, HOST: Hello Prime Minister, how are you?
ANTHONY ALBANESE, PRIME MINISTER: Good morning. I'm very, very well.
BRENDAN JONES, HOST: We could take up your time and say ask about your first school excursion that you went to back in the day.
KELLER: But there's more important things to discuss.
PRIME MINISTER: I can't remember what my first school excursion was.
KELLER: We've been talking about how all the kids these days are off to Paris or South America, whereas we went to a box factory.
PRIME MINISTER: Ours would have been something like that, I’m sure.
JONES: And look, you became Prime Minister of the country so it’s not a bad thing.
PRIME MINISTER: The Bradmills factory was across the road from my little school at St. Joseph's Camperdown, it probably would have been there.
KELLER: What did they make?
JONES: Shirts, I believe.
PRIME MINISTER: Textiles, seats and all sorts of things. It's now, of course, apartments.
KELLER: Of course it is.
PRIME MINISTER: Parramatta Road and Missenden Road there at Camperdown. So, it would have been something like that that would have been my first excursion, nothing exotic like Paris.
KELLER: No, you just get to suck in the chemicals. Well, let's get to the Voice. For the people who were still saying they don't quite understand, in a nutshell or not even in a nutshell, tell us what the Voice is.
PRIME MINISTER: It's two things, one recognising Indigenous Australians in our constitution. So at the moment there's a pretence almost that this great nation of ours began in 1788. So it's a matter of recognising Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander people as Australia's first peoples, that's the first thing. And the second thing is that Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander people should be consulted on matters that affect them. So they should have a body through local and regional voices, is the term that’s used, up to the national body. And it should be able to make representations on issues like health, and education, and housing, all the areas where there's a huge gap between Indigenous Australians and non-Indigenous Australians. So it's about those two simple things. It won't impact in terms of have a veto right of Parliament, it's not a third chamber, it's not going to be a funding body, it's just a body so that Indigenous people get to be heard, essentially.
JONES: And on the strength of that, I think, ‘well yeah, fair enough’. But then someone like Warren Mundine puts out in the paper today, and he was saying well, in 1967 they were recognised in the Constitution and that might water that down.
PRIME MINISTER: It's just not right. In 1967, of course, up to then Indigenous Australians weren't able to be counted in the census. They weren't regarded as full citizens and unfortunately that was there for 67 years in our Constitution and that was removed. And indeed, what was put in there was that the government would have the right to make laws which impacted people, Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander people, but it didn't recognise them as Australia's first people, which is a pretty fundamental thing. And the tragedy here is that in 1967 all the political parties came together, there was a Liberal government, the Labor opposition all supported it, and Australians overwhelmingly voted for it. That was what we were hoping for this time. The Liberal Party have chosen a different path but a range of people, Dominic Perrottet, the former Premier was a very strong supporter, Matt Kean, a range of the New South Wales Liberal Party effectively support the referendum being put to the Australian people sometime between October and December this year. This should be above politics. That doesn't mean that everyone should agree of course, and I respect Mr. Mundine or anyone else's right to have a different view. But overwhelmingly, Indigenous people gathered that Uluru which is where the Uluru Statement from the Heart comes from back in 2017. And I'd encourage your listeners to just get on Google and just read the Uluru Statement from the Heart, it's just 400 words.
KELLER: And it’s beautiful.
PRIME MINISTER: It is beautiful, it is poetry. It is extraordinary, that so many people from across our vast land of remote communities and people from the Torres Strait, and the Kimberley, Arnhem Land and right across this vast continent. Indigenous people met in a First Nations constitutional convention. There was five years of process and consultation, literally hundreds of meetings leading up to it. And that's where the Uluru Statement from the Heart came from, the cry essentially. It's a really gracious request for a hand out and asking us to just grasp the opportunity and I really hope that we do see as a nation this once in a generation opportunity.
JONES: Do you think as well Prime Minister, the thing about Australians we have two mouths in one ear and we don't really listen that much. Should we just be plain speaking about it and just say well, right, you're voting for this? This is my take from it, we're voting for this because we're recognising that First Nations peoples were here first, is that pretty much it?
KELLER: I think it’s about having a seat at the table.
JONES: I'm happy for that. First Nations people here were first, I appreciate that, and a seat at the table.
KELLER: But why not say seat at the table?
JONES: I’m happy for that. If that was the two prongs of it then I'm all for it. I want this to happen.
KELLER: It’s interesting that opponents are saying that as you said, it's not a separate chamber, you said that Prime Minister. But people are saying that they somehow are going to have a different rule or law for them. This isn't that is it?
PRIME MINISTER: No, it's not. Not at all. But what it is, is if you've got life expectancy, that's 10 years less for Indigenous Australians to non-Indigenous. If you've got huge gaps in health, in education, in economic opportunity, in infant mortality, in all of these areas, then we just need to do better. And the way you do better is to talk with people, is to consult them about what their lives are and how it can be improved, which is essentially what this is about giving them a voice. So the Uluru Statement concludes with words, I'm paraphrasing here off the top of my head, but in 1967 we were counted, in 2017 we asked to be heard.
KELLER: I’ve got goosebumps.
JONES: That's the part of it, that's the key part of it I find.
KELLER: It’s the nuts of it.
PRIME MINISTER: Oh, absolutely. And it also speaks about the torment of powerlessness. How things have been done for and to Aboriginal Australians, often with the best of intentions but the truth is that we need to do better. And when you look at the programs that have been really successful - justice reinvestment, Indigenous Rangers programs in Cape York, some of the educational outcomes that Noel Pearson and others have been able to achieve, lifting Indigenous peoples opportunities in life. They've all been programs that Indigenous people have had a direct say in and that sense of ownership, and that's really just common sense. It's good manners that if you're going to have something, engage in, you're doing something in your neighbourhood, in your backyard that's going to impact on your next door neighbour you talk to them about it – it’s good manners. And I think that this is, when it comes down to it about just that recognition - yep, you are here first, we should recognise that. This should be a source of pride. Aboriginal Australians are the oldest continuous culture on earth and we need to do more than just admire the art, and the music, and the culture. We need to recognise it in our Constitution, but then the Voice is really the means to the end. The end is to create opportunities so that you can't look at one group of people and just see that massive disadvantage which is there.
JONES: Well done.
KELLER: Thank you, Prime Minister.
JONES: Thank you very much.
PRIME MINISTER: It's great to chat with you, and have a lovely day.